nesly
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Posts: 2
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Post by nesly on Dec 4, 2017 14:06:02 GMT -4
I would not be so surprised to find out that a good amount of students are taking psych. meds because medical school can be very stressful and sometimes people need help to deal with these stressful situation. I must say that it is a big surprise to find out that 75% of students are in psychiatric meds. People have different way of coping with stress and we are all been there in medical school. now how you deal with it is your choice and I think that because it's so easy to get access to these drugs, we forget about the alternatives. I agree that some people really need the help, but most these issues could be resolved with better diet, exercise and time management. The case about the smart pill is a very difficult decision to make because of the high abuse potential of these drugs. Again I will say that some students are really in need of these neurostimulants because of lack of concentrations and been unable to focus, but how do we know for sure they are in need? Once they use it once and see the positive effect of it, they might never stop taking it and that can lead to abuse and much more. Physician just need to be very careful when prescribing these drugs and making sure that they are really needed.
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Post by Faithful Ogundiran on Dec 4, 2017 17:03:50 GMT -4
As regards the use of Neuroenhancers, I think that a physician prescribing that medication should depend on his understanding with the patient and also the long term effect of such prescription. Yes, it could help to improve concentration because these medications are for ADHD, but we need to look at the long term effect, patients who are perfectly fine could abuse it or decide that they can no longer focus without stimulants. Instead of doing things the right way, patients can actually depend on such medications. I do not think it should be an option especially to normal people. This benefits and risks should be carefully explained to intending patients and the patients should also be educated on non harmful ways to focus or improve concentration.
As regards med students and stimulants, it is saddening that the system is designed in such a way that if you don't take one form of stimulant or the other you'll most likely fail med school, even the professors sometimes encourage it. We go through a lot of stress, and the work load and even the thought of failing could be overwhelming which leave students no choice but to take stimulants and there's really no avenue to discuss or address one's mental health, many students depend on stimulants to keep them going. I think therapy should be made available to medical students because having someone to talk to and confide in could go a long way, This would be in a bid to lower the rate at which students use stimulants, and students should also be encouraged on natural ways to unwind instead of having to depend on stimulants.
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Post by favour zibiri on Dec 4, 2017 23:45:55 GMT -4
On the case of 75% of med. students on stimulants and antidepressants; It is a mediocre factual reality that is so predominant in this century and outrageously among us; It is no news that med. students and practitioners are indulgent in abuse of NE drugs and more so some students go as far as to indulge in mixing some of the most popular drugs like Adderall with alcohol knowing fully well the downsides of doing that(Alcohol poisoning, heart problems, behavioral issues) outweighs the euphoria feeling.`
One glimpse at the news can demonstrate how complex the world of medicine can be. As in any profession, the prestigious field we all dream of entering is often riddled with bias, discrimination, inhumane expectations, and even racial bias.Many medical students who choose to become physicians are competitive individuals who have followed paths focused on achievement their entire lives. No one takes the time to teach medical students how to be resilient and that failure is part of the process—even when it comes to taking board exams. Instead, they are expected to be the best and brightest at everything they do. To make matters worse, medical students are often discouraged from expressing their emotions. Otherwise, they are made to feel that they just aren’t cut out for this profession. Unfortunately, too much emphasis is placed on numbers, like test scores and medical school reputations. This emphasis creates an unhealthy—and unrealistic—pressure that implicitly endorses perfectionism and leaves little room for much-needed self-acceptance. Despite all the hard knocks of this path in medicine, Opening our eyes to the emotional challenges that medical students face should not deter medical students but motivate them all the more to make a difference in the field through proper self-discipline and determination, The use of stimulants to increase academic performance doesn't put them on the same plane with other students. Given the centrality of the brain to human health, its malfunction should be a priority, separated from stigma and treated on par with the diseases of the body. We aren’t there yet, but i believe the transformation is underway.
On the case of "Doc,I need a smart pill" : Based on the dependence of youths on the NE drugs, it only shows the decadence of the educational sector and how they fail to be involved in the Biopsychosocial life of these students which we know could be tasking but that's an expensive price to be paid based on the growth of the pharmaceutical system and therefore there's a high rate of dealing with its pros and cons.
There is a reason why a relationship between a patient and a doctor exists and it cannot be overemphasized because it goes a long way in the improvement of the patients life. Being a doctor he understands all that concerns a particular medical situation presented to him/her and knows the ethics of how to go about it mostly in terms of expression,interpretation and respect towards the patient. This relationship will further be strengthened by the patients trust in the abilities of his doctor although we know doctors aren't Gods and cant do it all alone and sometimes help in terms of counseling and therapy may be needed.
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Post by Fadi Ibrahim on Dec 8, 2017 1:38:24 GMT -4
i believe it is very sad that 75% of med. students are on stimulants but there are many factors that lead the student to the point where pill consumption of a stimulant is necessary in order to keep with the work load in med schools. However, i feel that if the student is able to organize their time properly, they will not have to use pills in order to keep up with the work load. I also believe that one of the main reasons that many students use amphetamines and other stimulants is that in the united states, it is very easy to get aderall prescribed which makes it easier for students to have access for the drug which highly encourages their use. I am canadian, and it is a lot harder for canadians to get aderral prescribed because doctors are aware that many students fake their ADHD assessment test just for the sake of getting adderal prescribed, and this is the main reason why aderrall or use of stimulants in general is not as popular in canada as it is in the US
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Post by Tsahi on Dec 9, 2017 17:13:48 GMT -4
It is not shocking that 75% of medical students abuse stimulants. The amount of information we have to go over, and the stress of exams (step 1 & 2) is ridiculous. We learn that depression decreases you ability to concentrate and to remember, so no wonder so many medical students are taking both antidepressants and something to help them to focus on studying for hours. I think most students in medical school lack the ability to satisfy all aspects of our needs that the brain requires (eg. social life, sleep, hobbies) to function properly. We get so caught up in studying all the time that we forget to attend to our individual needs. If we stop doing things thats give our brains the rest, and reset it needs its no wonder we fall into depression. Then we look for an immediate fix by taking pills to help us get through.
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Post by Ize Anumah on Dec 11, 2017 14:08:46 GMT -4
Risk vs Benefit, Non maleficience vs autonomy. The fact that prescribing NE for patients who do not qualify as cognitively impaired based on ADHD criteria is ethically permissible as opposed to obligatory puts the burden of this decision entirely on the physician. In the case of cosmetic surgeries, the patient is often referred to a psychiatrist for a psych evaluation to clear them before the surgery is performed. If prescribing NE are going to be put in the same boat as aesthetic surgeries then the same protocol should be applicable for both. If the patient is not cleared by a psychiatrist to use NE then it may not be prescribed. However, the problem of autonomy arises as patients need yo have a say in how they are managed, but as it was rightly put in the article, autonomy does not imply a physician gives out whatever prescription the patients asks for, instead he or she explains to the patient the risk and benefits of the treatment and gains consent. But with NE the question is, are the risks really greater than the benefits? Or are we just being skeptical because it puts some people a greater advantage over others? And the fact that it would most likely be paid for out of pocket, would that translate to the more money you have, the smarter you get, the better you perform? In the society today, the money already gets people places they may or may not have qualified to be, would it now also succeed in replacing hard work? That would be an unfortunate situation. If i were Dr Warren, I believe I would explain empathetically, if he did not meet the criteria for any cognitive impairment, the problems that could arise from indiscriminate prescription of NE as well as enlighten him on ways to train his perfectly functioning mind on how to get him to were he needs to be academically and otherwise.
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Post by gabriellewade on Dec 11, 2017 18:48:12 GMT -4
There are numerous medications which are used for reasons other than those which were initially intended by the FDA which have shown various improvements in various diseases and medical conditions. However, the use of Neuroenhancement drugs for non existent cognitive impairment is a very controversial topic. In my opinion, in this situation a doctor should only prescribe this type of medication for those who really need it such as those suffering from ADD or ADHD. This type of medication can even be used in those such as in this case who are seeking to improve their memory and concentration, however, only in cases where an impairment in memory and concentration can be proven, even if not severe enough to be formally diagnosed as having ADD or ADHD. It should not be prescibed to those who just lack confidence and think that they can only do well on a test with the extra push of the medication. If taken in this situation and one sees academic improvement this may lead to addiction and dependence and other side effects with may surface with long term use. Med Students and Stimulants Unfortunately, it really is not surprising that the percentage of medical students who takes stimulants is so high. For example, at my previous rotations, I would often hear students discussing their plans for the night ahead and say " When I get home I'm going to pop an addy and study all night". At first it was very shocking to hear them say this as if it were a normal thing to do such as going to the gym or ordering a pizza. However, the more I heard it, the more normal it became. It became evident that this is just what some medical studets do in order to cope with the vast amount of material we are expected to learn. On another occasion, a precetor asked me question one time in a previous rotation and at the moment I could not recall the answer as I don't do well with "on the spot" questions. Afterwards, another student suggested to me to take a stimulant which he thought would help with my recall problem. This made it even more evident of how normalized medical students taking stimulants has become. I, for one, am against taking any stimulant with regards to studying, but to each his own!
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Post by Alicia Salamani on Dec 17, 2017 15:33:30 GMT -4
Well this is no surprise, believe it or not I didn't even know this type of drug was being prescribed for performance enhancing until I went to medical school. I feel as though this is on the same level as a professional Olympic Athlete taking their performance enhancing drugs. As a student that works so hard and yes I am a little slow and I do get distracted during my study sessions, I feel as though it is an injustice. There is not a time where I felt as though my hard work wouldn't pay off. I can completely understand the stresses and the emotional and physical aspect of it all being in medical school. I do feel as though before medication and before pills are given to students in these higher professional education programs, there should be a course or even a Cognitive behavior therapy lesson to assess and help the patient deal with the stress, depression or anxiety that comes with test taking. I think this would avoid all of this. Believe it or not one of my preceptors had a patient come in and say she could not write her Phd without help she is distracted. The doctor ended up sending her to psychiatrist to assess if she truly does need medication for adult onset ADHD or if it was just for NE.
On the one hand, I am also the type of person that will avoid any medication or giving patients any pills to take if it can be avoided. I have had the experience myself as a patient. I had gone to the office and told my doctor I am feeling tired and sluggish I sleep 10+ hours and have issues focusing and concentrating. Well instead of taking the time to listen to me she wrote me a script for antidepressant and moved onto the next patient. Not factoring in that I had a BMI of 50+ and I was severely obese. I took into my own hands ripped the script and started to lose weight. So yes I feel as though a lot of this world is being perceived as anything can be solved with pills instead of looking at the overall picture!
I also do understand if a patient truly needs the medication then they do deserve to have this to help them as those who are diagnosed with ADHD but there has to be a way of documenting or understand how to give a questionnaire to ween out the ones with neuroenhancing goals.
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Post by Barsun K. on Dec 30, 2017 18:19:08 GMT -4
By: Barsun K.
The article i'm responding to is "75% of med students are on antidepressants or stimulants (or both)" and “Doc, I Need a Smart Pill”—Requests for Neurologic Enhancement
Stimulants! Where should I begin? I was Diagnosed with ADHD when I was 7 years old (I think). My parents (my mother in particular) were very resistant to my ADHD Diagnosis, as well as to me being placed on ADHD medication. I think my mother's inability to accept my diagnosis prompted the same resistant feelings in me. The simple terms "lack of focus" or "inattentiveness" did not even began to describe my symptoms. I was all over the place! I was not only inattentive; I was also hyperactive and impulsive. I had the full package--ADHD combined type!
I was intelligent but my grades fluctuated dramatically. My focus was mainly dependent on my interest in the subject material or what outside stressors I had going on at the time. I was left back in 3rd grade and again in 7th grade. Then I was skipped out of 7th grade and placed back in 8th grade because regardless of my hyperactivity, inability to stay focused and propensity toward getting in trouble, academically, I was too advanced to remain in the 7th grade a second time. I was later skipped from the 10th grade to the 12th grade. Ultimately, I graduated on time, even though I had been left back twice. I do not believe ADHD affects IQ or at least it is not a true reflection of IQ. Nevertheless, the deficits created by ADHD can result in lower academic performance.
The fall after graduating high school I started college. Unfortunately, even in college, I had a difficult time sitting in class. I would get bored and get out my seat 2-5 times during every lecture to "go to the bathroom." That is, if I went to lecture at all. I would more than often just spend the day in the library studying. I'd stay there for 14 hours almost every day, even weekends. The problem was I just kept getting up. I'd be in the library 14 hours and I'd be lucky if I got 5 hours studying completed. I just couldn't stay in my seat.
Nevertheless, overtime I realized that if I could find something about the material I was studying to spark my interest I would be totally zoned into the information as if I were transfixed by it. I had the ability to become "hyper-focused." However, I could not control when this would happen so, some days I would spend the entire day in the library and get, literally, no work done. I would go home so frustrated! This went on for years. Eventually, after 5 long years, I completed Undergrad. Immediately afterwards, I completed a Master’s degree. Again, during this time, I attended school, every summer, spring and fall semester. I had fallen in love with learning. It would take me forever to cover material but all I did was study so, somehow it all worked out. Eventually, I found my way to medical school. I took the MCAT, passed with an average score and was matriculated to a well-known United States Medical school. I did all this without using stimulants (minus the occasional cup of coffee).
Although I loved learning, studying all the time and managing life's pressures would become overwhelming at times. To circumvent being perpetually stressed, I would see a therapist regularly, just to talk. It gave me a chance to unwind. I had regular therapy sessions all through my undergraduate and graduate years.
All this time I studied without stimulants. If I wasn't studying I was reading a novel. Learning became second nature to me. Did I still have ADHD? Emphatically, yes! I remember covering this one chemistry chapter. It took me 56 hours to complete. I was on break from school. I would wake up, study the chapter until I fell asleep, wake up and do the same thing the next day. Putting so many hours in to cover a chapter didn't bother me because I thought it was "normal." When I completed the chapter I knew the material well. I owned the information. I always assumed that every serious science student was doing the same thing. It wasn't until I got to Medical School that I learned the truth.
While in medical school, I continued to see a therapist. The only difference was, this therapist happened to be a Clinical Psychologist. I would see her once a week for an hour. I looked forward to our sessions. I poured my sole out to her and always left feeling better than I had when I first walked in the door. During one of our sessions, as I sat there animatedly detailing the events of my week, she cocked her head to the side and interrupted me saying, "you have ADHD! It all makes since now. You're ADD!" I just smiled and said in a calm voice, "I know."
Over the next few weeks she pressured me to began ADHD treatment, convinced I would be better off if I addressed my ADHD symptoms medically. I was hesitant but not as resistant as I had been whenever this argument had surfaced over the previous 20 years. I had grown to trust Jill. If Jill recommended treatment, it was because she truly believed I would be better off with it than I was currently. My initial treatment regimen was Adderall 10mg QD.
I sat down in the coffee shop, put my ear plugs in and opened my book to study. Still hesitant, I broke the pill in half and swallowed the better of the two pieces. I began to read the pages. Nothing happened. I tried forcing myself to focus on the material but nothing was different. Maybe my mother was right. I didn't have ADHD! I was perfectly normal.
I continued to read. 20 minutes later, a fog lifted from my thoughts. Never had my mind been so clear! I experienced a focus unlike anything I had ever known in life. I did not get up to pee. I didn't take a break. My head never lifted from the page. I was totally and completed zoned in. For 3 hours nothing else existed.
That night, as I tried to explain my experience to my best friend, I cried so much. All I could think about was how much time I had wasted! If only I had listened earlier and got help. Overnight my life changed dramatically. I never studied without Adderall. For the first time in my life I could expect that when I sat down to study I would get work down every time. If I studied for 6 hours then I got 6 hours of work done. This was a totally new concept for me.
However, there was a problem developing that I never really considered. I was rapidly losing all the compensatory mechanisms I had developed over the years. After a few months, I no longer had the patience to study without Adderall. I could not force myself to remain in a library for 14 hours and walk out only getting 4-6 hours of work done. Eventually, multiple side effects developed. I began experiencing serious insomnia (something I never dealt with before). Apparently, stimulants keep you from sleeping at night. Who knew? A slew of problems eventually resulted from my stimulant use.
If I could go back in time I would have never taken them! I have near textbook ADHD but over the years I developed multiple coping mechanisms to circumvent many of my deficits. As clear as my mind felt when I was taking Adderall, it was unnatural. It ended up costing me a lot. And I know from experience that I am not the only person that's been negatively affected by Stimulant medication. Appreciate the talents your given. Hard work, grit, perseverance, intelligence--these are the tools that are needed to succeed in medical school. These attributes were used to forge physicians way before artificial Adderall hit the scene. Albert Einstein is one of many famous (and brilliant) people who had ADHD. If he was placed on a stimulant as a child and forced to Adhere to traditional learning styles, would he still have reached his peak?
Medical Students, Residents and Physicians should not use stimulants. The cost is greater than the benefit. Without Stimulants I matriculated to a United States Medical School. I was ranked in the middle of my class. 5 years after starting stimulants i'm repeating my last 2 years of medical school at a no name Caribbean School.
Regardless of my experience, my argument is not that a person with legitimate verifiable ADHD should not be treated medically. That is not what I am implying. Nevertheless, I do believe that these drugs should not be used as neuro-enhancement mechanisms for medical students or to stay up late and study or for any non-medical reason. Diamonds are forged by pressure! Ultimately, removing the struggle from learning diminishes its value. If no one used Stimulants without a medically verifiable reason and everyone had to put the work in to reach their goals we would all be better in the long run. I know I would have been.
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Jorge Hernandez Canciobello
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Post by Jorge Hernandez Canciobello on Jan 8, 2018 9:01:20 GMT -4
75% of med students are on antidepressants or stimulants (or both): Sadly this percentage is real and possibly even lower than the actual number. Medical students are dealing with a humongous amount of pressure and stress in their lives. The use of stimulants or antidepressants can be a quick and easy “fix” to our problems. I personally release stress exercising. Honestly it is extremely hard for me because TIME is a very precious variable and it is hard to have fixed gym hours due to our demanding clinical rotation schedule. Many of my friends use Adderall as a daily stimulant to maintain the crazy rhythm of our academical duties. The chronic/long term use of those stimulants can be addictive and also cause several side effects like cardiovascular problems (HTN, tachycardia), sleep problems (insomnia), headaches, tremors, weight loss, and constipation, among others. I suppose antidepressants can also be used by my colleagues, but I think not all of them are willing to share that information with everybody due to the fear of being judged. We are forced to continue this demanding and highly competitive career. Physicians are 1.87 times more likely to commit suicide. They are in the second place of all professions only surpassed by Marine engineers. Stress management becomes crucial to allow us to put an end to this journey and future challenges.
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Post by JamarArcher on Feb 23, 2018 12:33:47 GMT -4
Med Students & Stimulants
The statistics in this article are worrying to say the least but not necessarily surprising. During med school emphasis is heavy on learning EVERYTHING in a short space of time and then being great during our rotations and exams in order to get good placement. Honestly how many of us have really not taken a stimulant at one point during our studies to help us “push through” a bit longer? The fact that 75% of medstsudent or residents are taking stimulants or anti depressants or both is not at all surprising and further goes to show the demand that medschool puts on students during and after they qualify. Though I myself have never taken anti depressants, I have taken some stimulants in the form of caffeine to help with those late nights of studying or finishing assignments etc. after all the work and hours we put into the classroom, then to be mentally broken down to the point of inadequacy by our attending physicians and preceptors when we are unable to quickly recall a drug or presenting symptoms of a condition. This basically boils down to bullying, which can easily chip away at ones self esteem thereby leading to depression. This is a very real and pressing problem and one that should be addressed and spoken about from the time students enter medschool. Hopefully these numbers can be improved and eventually eradiccated.
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